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slow lifan 12?

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 15-09-2007, 06:50 PM
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slow lifan 12?

Hey everyone just bought a new lifan motor. was advertised as a 125 but has 120 stamped on the head. My mates ducar 125 eats it. was wondering what i can do to make it smoke the ducar. Its a 1P54FMI.
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Old 15-09-2007, 08:50 PM
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If it's a 1P54FMI then it's either a 123 if it has a 54 mm crank or a 127 if it has a 55.5 mm crank .......... 120's are 1P52FMI ............ with a 55.5 mm stroke .........

If your motor is new ...... then you shouldn't be stupid and trying to race your mates Ducar 125 yet ............ new motors are tight (gears , valve guides and bore) and loosen up to make more power over time as they wear in ........ they take quite a while to wear in properly not just a few tanks as some gooses will have you believe ......... (Honda says 2,500 miles for XR75's) .......... if you go flogging it and trying to rev it out now ........ you'll severely shorten the life of it ......... and end up with a slow , sluggish , unreliable oil burner with shifting problems ....... that you'll howl and moan about like a lot of other people on here ......... LOL .........

The best mods you can do are a carefully done port and flow job (not a hogged out hack job) ........ manifold match up ........ properly jetted and tuned carb of the proper flow to suit your head and pipe ........ decent exhaust pipe that's 28 mm stepping up to 32 mm diameter ...... improved CDI box ...... then you can go with a hi po cam ........ high lift springs ......... lightened rocker arms ......... higher compression piston ......

A lot of people don't understand this ...... but in a successfully modified engine everything works together synergistically as a combination ........ meaning the final power output will far exceed the improvement gained from each individual modification on their own ...... added together .........

You can actually LOSE power by putting the combo out with the wrong cam or hogged out head and get blown away around a track by a modded engine with a stock cam .......

Incidentally ..... it's possible that your mate has a "fluke" or "freak" Ducar 125 ........... freak motors are ones that just happen to have been put together at the factory with all the tolerances extremely close to the original designing engineers' blue prints .... ie port cores in the right position for max flow ..... piston to bore clearance and bore centreline precisely aligned with the crank centreline and axis ........ etc ......... Basically like a blue printed engine off the factory floor ....

Then you get the exact opposite ....... TIGHT engines (the result of being slapped together with randomly selected parts) with a lot of things not right ..... that need extensive running in to get things working smoothly and freely with minimal friction .........
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Old 15-09-2007, 08:59 PM
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woah so many full stops
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Old 15-09-2007, 09:12 PM
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LOL ....... I've got ......... "Tourettes" ...... syndrome or .........."Ozzy .......... Ozbourne" syndrome ......... so I type ......... instead of ......... f'*$#@ ck

Last edited by Cactus Jack : 16-09-2007 at 12:29 AM.
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Old 15-09-2007, 10:17 PM
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thanx for all that jack. only new to this stuff so wasnt sure how to go about it. was told to put a bigger carb than the standard 25mm on will that help? the head is stamped as a 120 and the bottom has got 1p54fmi. how do i tell if it has a 54 or 55.5 mm crank?
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Old 16-09-2007, 12:22 AM
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It's pretty hard to measure the stroke accurately without taking the head off . 1.5 mm difference 'aint much anyway .

You could try sticking a plastic drinking straw down the spark plug hole marking it with a fine tipped texta with the piston at top dead centre then again at bottom dead centre . Then measure the distance between the two marks .... who knows ?? the bush mechanics method might work .... LOL ......

If you have a big valve head (valve covers with 2 bolts) then a "30" Mikuni (26 mm) will work better up top .......
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Old 16-09-2007, 01:35 AM
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You can tell if it has 54 or 55.5 stroke pretty easily, as far as i know, none of the 54mm crank lifan engines had the clutch on mainshaft (they don't start in any gear). So if yours can start in gear, then you've got a 55.5 stroke
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Old 16-09-2007, 06:40 PM
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No worries. Wont start in any gear so it must be the 123cc.
Just got me stuffed why its stamped with 120 if its not. Thanx for all the info guys ill go and start doin some mods.Cheers.
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Old 16-09-2007, 08:23 PM
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Actually 123.6722256 cc ....... LOL . Equal bore x stroke (aka square) motors rev harder and don't get as hot as longer strokers . They've got the best balance between torque and HP ......... Long stroke motors reach critical mass of the reciprocating parts much earlier meaning they hit a mechanical rev limiter and they break parts and wear out much quicker if revved constantly.........

Note how Honda went to a Bore of 66 mm and a Stroke of only 43.7 mm when they wanted a Hi Powered 4 stroke race engine for the CRF150R !!!!!!!! They achieved around 22HP stock and there's NO way on the planet that they would have done it with a longer stroke . Most of the gains are from cutting down on piston speed and reducing rod angularity which equates to a drastic cut in friction from piston thrust on the cylinder wall . That allows them to use a lightweight low drag piston with virtually NO skirt .

In a lot of cases you can gain a lot of power simply by cutting out frictional and drag losses which are similar to the brakes on a vehicle dragging and holding it back ........

I have modified XR75's since 1974 and have found that a 50 mm bore a 41.5 stroke goes the hardest ........ I've bored them to 54 mm (Powroll 96 cc kit) but the rev limit dropped drastically . The 54 mm piston is a lot heavier and the extra cc's of the bore can only breath to the max limit of the head .

Incidentally I have a genuine Yoshimura close ratio 5 speed tranny that has super thin gears less than 7 mm wide . That tranny alone increases the rear wheel power by heaps due to far less oil drag on the thinner gears .

Taylors mowers (GT Motors Aust) used to have pamphlets stating that you could order Jialing 125's with special thinner geared racing trannies ...... but the added price was sky high .
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Old 17-09-2007, 07:48 PM
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Cool. One last question. Is it possible that they have bolted on the wrong head to my motor? As the the head says 120cc but the stamp on the motor says 1P54FMI, should the head say 123 or 124. The guys at DHZ reckon I got the 120. Buggered if I know.
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